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Why just hudud?

IT is understandably very easy to demonise PAS for its Islamic state agenda. After all, the party leadership seems quite adept at declaring its intentions to implement some features of an Islamic state, such as hudud, at the most inopportune moments.

In a global climate of Islamophobia and because of Muslims acting out of a siege mentality, including in Malaysia, Islam’s poster men and women are unfortunately irrational bigots. Or terrorists. Or barbaric and autocratic regimes such as the Taliban. Hence, PAS’s recent repeat about implementing hudud in multiracial Malaysia can only further fuel some people’s distrust of the world’s second largest, and fastest-growing religion.

But it is way too easy to be blindsided by prejudices against Islam, and against a self-avowed Islamist party such as PAS. Hence, even more so, we should rigorously test the assumptions and query the public rhetoric surrounding PAS and the Islamic state it wants for Malaysia. This is the question we need to ask as Malaysians: Is PAS really the only political party that has an Islamic state agenda in Malaysia?

Umno, too

When PAS vice-president Datuk Husam Musa declared in December 2008 that the party would have implemented hudud had the Pakatan Rakyat taken over government on 16 Sept 2008, he wasn’t the only one supporting an Islamic penal code. He was speaking at an open debate with Umno Youth deputy chief Khairy Jamaluddin. When prodded, Khairy himself seemed to indicate he would support an Islamic penal code if he became Umno Youth chief in the upcoming March 2009 party elections. 

After publication of the report that described this incident, however, a YouTube video has been posted that challenges the description of what happened. Instead, what Khairy is clearly heard saying is, “Secara jelas, kita teruskan apa yang ada. Itu dasar kerajaan Barisan Nasional (BN).”

But what policy is this that Khairy stands by, and how much better is it, in the context of a secular democracy, compared with what PAS is projecting?

We need to remind ourselves that Umno, and the current policies being perpetuated by an Umno-led BN, has just as much of an Islamic state agenda as PAS does. For example, no less than former prime minister Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad declared in September 2001 that “Malaysia is already an Islamic state”. In July 2007, even prime-minister-in-waiting Datuk Seri Najib Razak declared that Malaysia was an Islamic state. “We have never been a secular state,” he was widely reported to have said.

Alarmingly, right after this statement, the government, under Najib’s helm because Prime Minister Datuk Seri Abdullah Ahmad Badawi was on holiday in Australia, issued a media ban on all discussions about the matter. This is something I personally experienced as assistant news editor at theSun.

In Islam’s name

In the run-up to the 8 March 2008 general election, one of the most effective pro-opposition SMSes that flew like pollen in the wind was this one that was attributed to blogger Raja Petra Kamarudin: “Umno is more Islamic & dangerous than PAS. Who breaks ur temples? Who put 5 in ISA? Who declare M’sia Islamic country? Who snatch dead bodies? Who kill in police custody? Who create bumiputra? Who break family using syariah law?…Who use khalwat to spy on people? Who implement Islamic policy in schools? It is BN. For 50 yrs they brainwashed us to think that they are moderate. They are the extremists.”

To that list, I might add that it is also under the current administration that Muslims are denied the religious freedom to choose another faith. Under this same administration, the Catholic Herald and all other non-Muslim groups are banned from using the word “Allah”.

Malaysians signing a petition against the Islamic Family Law amendment, January 2006 (Pic courtesy of Ezrena)

Additionally, it was the BN government that, in late 2005, passed amendments to the Islamic Family Law that were not only grossly unjust to Muslim women but were also un-Islamic. And today, it is the BN government that is making it mandatory for Muslims to undergo flawed pre-marital HIV testing, which may even be extended to non-Muslims.

So, yes, PAS needs to be taken to task for not giving up its Islamic state agenda for a nation that was founded as a secular democracy. But, so should Umno, which, perhaps more cleverly, is less transparent about its attempts to infuse certain kinds of Islamic laws and teachings into public policy. And when these laws and teachings are contested, what’s worse is that public discussion is curtailed through silencing and fear. Or sometimes, by telling concerned non-Muslims not to worry because it doesn’t affect them. We should bear in mind that this is an oft-used argument both BN leaders and Opposition Leader Datuk Seri Anwar Ibrahim are guilty of.

Umno may not be promoting hudud. For now. But more importantly, what is clear is that they haven’t publicly opposed it, either. And, from the examples above, the Umno-led BN clearly has aspirations for an Islamic state of sorts. And I mean in a prejudiced way that perverts the more inclusive and just interpretations of all discourses “Islamic”. Because I believe that Islam promotes justice, fairness and compassion as exhorted by notable Muslim organisations such as Sisters in Islam, and Muslim scholars such imam Feisal Abdul Rauf.

Should PAS be questioned about its Islamic state agenda? Yes, I think it should. Should we also hold Umno accountable for its own Islamic agenda? Yes, again. If PAS’s only outrageous statement was about implementing hudud law, Umno, by far, definitely has more to answer for in the name of Islam.

Jacqueline Ann Surin is not fearful of Islam. She’s afraid of those in power who act in the name of Islam to perpetuate fear, distrust, injustice, bigotry and a lack of thinking and questioning.

See also:
Hudud and democracy

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39 Responses to “Why just hudud?”

  1. Myno says:

    Whatever it is, hudud has no place in Malaysia and should be rejected by all. It’s inhumane to impose a 7th century penal code in a 21st century society.

  2. Tennou Heika says:

    Hudud is part of Islam and is mentioned clearly in the Qur’an. Rejecting hudud is rejecting Islam.

    Anyway, hudud was part of the law of several states before the Portugese/Dutch/British occupation. Re-instating the hudud is just natural.

  3. David says:

    Thank you, Jacqueline for pointing out the hypocrisy of the BN-led government and putting the ball firmly back in their court.

  4. lim says:

    I am a non-Muslim but I will vote for PAS and hudud rather than the BN that labelled and treated me as a penumpang. It is politically right for PAS to advocate hudud – after all, it is an Islamic party. But why worry – do you think PAS has the majority to vote in hudud in Parliament – obviously not.

    Even if PAS is successful in implementing hudud, do you think the non-Muslims will quietly accept this hudud law?? Again, obviously not. Hudud is just political rheoteric. Let PAS talk about it – no harm.

  5. Flora G says:

    Totally agree with you. It was and is an insidious approach taken by the BN Umno whilst the other component parties went into denial mode to safeguard their territory. Just wish that this article could be made available to a wider audience.

  6. Sabic says:

    Today, the Malaysian Syariah Law is only in its 2nd gear of hudud law and we have already witnessed the havoc it created like demolishing temples, body snatching, caning of young people, moral policing, oppressing other Malays who don’t subscribe to their brand of Islam, among others.

    Once hudud law shifts to auto cruise, Malaysia will become a full-fledged “Islamic state”. By default, all Malaysians irrespective of race or religion becomes the “subject” of the state. That is why they have this law called “jizya” payment imposed on non-Muslims under hudud. Will it stop only at the “jizya”? No, never!

    At the time when Lim Kit Siang is seen to be sitting alone with a woman, the religious department will charge him for khalwat. Once a syariah court passes a judgement, there is no way LKS can take his case to the civil court.

    Similarly, if someone sees Karpal Singh having a glass of wine with some friends, the syariah court will charge him for consuming alcohol and according to the mini hudud in all the states today, Karpal Singh will get six stroke of the rotan, plus a fine. And who knows, when the hudud goes in full auto cruise, Karpal may get double the punishment because they can claim he is a bad influence on the Muslims.

    Hudud law is real and scary.

    • Flag of Truth says:

      @ Sabic

      Your way of thinking really amuses me. So let us look at this scenario:

      a. You have a teenaged daughter (say she is 18 years old) and you love her very much. But since you are living in a ‘modern’ society, you must willing to see guys [fornicate with] her and you can not do anything about that because it is the ‘right’ thing to do?

      b. let’s say that you are a woman, a wife who waits for her husband at home but he is busy drinking at some pub somewhere and [on his way back], you have to face the possibility of him being involved in a car accident. Or if he manages to come back, he might hit you because of his impaired judgement.

      ** I don’t want to live in that kind of situation. Hudud law is from Allah and it is only concerns MUSLIMS only.

  7. fizi says:

    Hudud itu hanyalah undang-undang untuk orang Islam sahaja. Orang bukan Islam tidak tertakluk dengan hukum ini. Hudud itu bermaksud “had”, maknanya apa yang tidak boleh dilakukan oleh orang Islam. Contoh, tak boleh minum arak, tak boleh membunuh, tak boleh khalwat, tak boleh zina, tak boleh rasuah…sebab benda-benda yang tak boleh ni akan merosakkan masyarakat.

    Hukum ni “manual” yang Tuhan buatkan untuk orang Islam patuhi. Kalau anda ada motosikal, tapi tak diguna ikut manual yang diberi, bolehkah anda, misalnya, pasangkan tayar basikal pada motor?

  8. Karcy says:

    Kassim Ahmad has some interesting things to say about hudud.

  9. Kamal says:

    Finally, someone has said it as it is. The current government appears to be working towards recognising the Malaysian syariah on par with the civil courts, with a twist — that it concerns only Muslims.

    By doing so, we make two assumptions about Malaysian society:
    1. that there are only two cultural domains in Malaysia; that of the Muslim and non-Muslim, and
    2. that these domains are distinct and do not impinge on the other.

    I am not sure how PAS will implement Islamic law; whether or not they see it as the dominant law and how their intepretation of it will affect non-Muslim citizens. But now, the ones who strenghten the syariah instrument appear to be the government.

    My question, I suppose, is where do Islamic laws in Malaysia emerge from? Of course, the source of Islamic laws are the Quran, Hadith and council. But how are these made into laws? Who makes the intepretations, and how are these interpretations made legitimate and instrumental?

    Also, with limited resources — both in the intellectual sphere of Islamic jurisprudence and in implementation of the laws — do we have any semblance of check and balance? Or like Jakim, do other Islamic institutions fall directly under the executive office of government? Or are they elitists in that inclusion is limited by professed expertise?

    Is there any way for public representation in the intepretations and rendering of Islamic laws? Islamic laws fundamentally preaches compassion and justice; where is the justice if we are selective in who gets punished as in the case of the recent conviction and sentencing of two people for consuming alcohol?

    And, for a law that also preaches reform, isn’t inflicting six lashes of the cane and imposing a RM5,000 fine actually harsh? Not only are we punishing the individual excessively but if he/she pays RM5,000, that means we are taking away income from the family and directly punishing them as well, especially if the convicted is the primary breadwinner.

    Worse, the judge is actually empowered to sentence the convicted to a maximum of three years in prison. The law permits it, and what if a judge actually passes that sentence? Isn’t this zalim?

    Finally, Islamic law also claims righteousness, why then do Malaysian Islamic authorities fear public debate? If we, the public, are truly uneducated, shouldn’t there be more public discussions?

    Islamic law is not exotic and should not be mystified and left to the experts to interpret. It should be a law that is accessible for all. Surely the primacy of law is not the imposition of elite dogma on the population, but the expresion of the population onto itself.

  10. Dear friends,

    I’m a Muslim. Hudud is stated in the Quran. As Muslims, we can’t say no to hudud. If we do? It’s just like we say “no” to Islam and we are no longer Muslim — murtad. The Quran and hadis are our faith.

    What is stated in the Quran and hadis we must abide by. For sure the Quran and hadis are for Muslims. Muslims can’t make an issue out of hudud. We can’t say hudud can’t be implemented in this country, but it will. We never know when, but as a Muslim, don’t make this an issue and say “No, we can’t have this law in this country.”

    Just keep silent because it does no harm to anyone if we just keep silent. Don’t lose your faith as a Muslim. Believe in the Quran and hadis. It is stated in rukun iman. Stop these issues.

    Check out this campaing: Let’s read the Quran. This campaign is not only for Muslims, but also for our brothers and sisters who are Christians, Buddhists Hindus, Sikhs and those who believe in a God-Head but are not so gung-ho about being in any brand of religion. Come join us and share your ideas! You can join this campaign even if you are an atheist! For more, see:

    • faraabdul says:

      Which part in the Quran says hudud refers to what most Muslims think i.e, penal code for maksiat? The last time I checked, none of the verses in the Quran mentioning hudud is [about] punishment for fornicating, consuming alcohol, apostasy and etc.

      Regarding hadith, […] we have hadith sunni version, also hadith syiah version. Each sect claims they are the righteous but who gives the authority to decide what is right?

      So lets say we follow hadith that says death to all apostates. The Quran explicitly mentioned anyone can believe in Allah or not repeatedly. If the Quran; the word of God permits one to become apostate, why do we follow hadith which claimed to be originated from the prophet? Does the Prophet Muhammad have the same authority as Allah? Did Allah […] mention death for apostates in the Quran? I know Muslims will deny, but it clearly shows you [some] would rather follow human hearsay than the word of God. […]

      Other punishments e.g. fornication for married persons and consuming alcohol have no basis in the Quran; purely human-made rulings, if not originated from the Bible. In fact, the Quran never prescribed stoning people to death or giving strokes for consuming alcohol. How can you say hudud is from God when the majority of the punishments have no basis in the Quran?

      If you want to implement law, you need to know the law; the source used, why, how etc. Not simply relying on some self-proclaimed experts telling you what to do. This is especially true for Muslims. No wonder so many Muslims are being duped by their religious leaders.

      • Flag of Truth says:

        # faraAbdul

        Yes indeed, the Quran never stated about punishment for fornication and adultery. And I have mentioned it more that twice today (in different articles) that to understand the Quran, you cannot only look at the translation and make your own assumption.

        I have to explain it again :). The verses in the Quran reflects certain situation concerning the life of Muhammad, rules and regulations and also stories of the prophets and great personalities from the past. When particular verses were revealed to Muhammad (pbuh), he would explain it to his ‘companion’ (referring to his friends and those who were around him at that time) about the meaning of that particular verse. Now this is called ‘hadith’ – where his quotes are collected from the companions.

        The hadith regarding fornication is from hadiths by Abu Dawood:

        Imran bin Husain said: A woman belonging to the tribe of Juhainah came to the Propeht (salallahu ‘alahi wasallam) and said that she had committed fornication and that she was pregnant. The apostle of Allah (salallahu ‘alahi wasallam) called her guardian. Then the apostle of Allah (salallahu ‘alahi wasallam) said to him: Do good to her, and when she bears a child, bring her. When she delivered the child, he brought her. The Prophet (salallahu ‘alahi wasallam) gave orders regarding her, and her clothes were tied on her. He then commanded regarding her and she was stoned to death, and commanded the people and they prayed over her. Thereupon Umar (radiyallahu ta’ala ‘anhu) said: Are you praying over her?, Apostle of Allah (salallahu ‘alahi wasallam), while she has committed fornication? He said: By Whom in Whose hand is my soul, she has repented to such an extent that if it were divided among the seventy people of Medina, it would have been enough for them all. And what do you find a thing better than the fact that she gave her life? (Abu Dawood)

  11. misshome says:

    “The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge.”

    I think you just proved that.

  12. Davy says:

    Jacqueline Ann Surin needs to read Islamic history from a Catholic perspective. Maybe the Vatican can assist her.

    For a start, one man against two women, is sufficient to award her flogging under hudud laws. So, please do not support something you know little about. Read up, girl!

  13. Ariah says:

    Extracted from the “As I see it” blog:

    The media often leaves the public with the impression that under hudud, people are going to be punished based on limited or even flimsy evidence. This is not true. Islamic law requires a very high level of proof for the most serious crimes and punishments. When there is doubt about the guilt of a Hadd (‘felony’ type) crime, the judge must treat the crime as a lesser Tazir (‘misdemeanor’ type) crime. If there is no confession to a crime or not enough witnesses to the crime, Islamic law requires the Hadd crime to be punished as a Tazir crime.

    Syariah is only application to Muslims, not non-Muslims. So, there should not be any issue here.

  14. Fadz says:

    What about hudud punishment for someone like Lina Joy? Is it fair for her to be punished under hudud law because she chose to leave Islam? There are many others like her. I reject hudud.

  15. Aero says:

    Jacqueline, you need to stop being so paranoid about Islam in the first place. People like you who are pinpointing things that doesn’t concern you at all are most likely the ones threatening the peace we have. Pitting up Muslims against Muslims, Bumiputera against Bumiputera seems to be your kind of favourite game now, isn’t it?

    • Adam says:


      If you know that Jacqueline is a Christian Bumiputra, would you still say such things about her? When UMNO and PAS are trying to outdo each other in all things Malay and Islamic, they do not seem to realise that there are other Bumiputras who are neither Malay nor Muslims.

      While UMNO is fighting for Malay/Muslim rights and PAS for Muslim/Islamic prominence, who is defending the rights of the other non-Muslim and non-Malay Bumiputras. You cannot expect Taib Mahmud and Musa Aman to do so.

      Jacqueline is trying to tell the two factions that in trying to “out-Islamicise” each other, the real essence of Islam is actually lost. Just sit back and ponder the state of Islamic affairs in Malaysia and you will realise that something is indeed amiss.

    • neptunian says:

      Nobody needs to be paranoid about Islam or try to pit Muslims against Muslims. The Middle East or Pakistan are very good examples.

    • JW Tan says:

      It is wrong to kill someone for leaving a religion. It is also wrong to imprison, punish, brainwash, reschool or otherwise condemn them for their decision, from a legal perspective. Whatever a holy book says, the state apparatus should not be directed at what is essentially a private matter.

      So, if the Quran says Lina Joy should be punished under syariah law, then the right thing to do is to make sure that syariah law has no place in Malaysia. Or maybe, Malaysia’s interpretation of the Quran is in error. I do not know which. But it needs to be fixed.

      The person who breaks the peace is the one that throws the first blow. Not the one who says provocative things. Most people learn this, maybe around the age of 5.

      • Flag of Truth says:

        # JW Tan

        Leave Muslim matters to Muslim. There is nothing wrong with the interpretation. It is what the Quran says it is, which is from Allah. Embracing Islam means accepting the whole of Islamic principles and its teaching.

        You feel that the punishment for apostates is cruel and inhumane but Allah knows best. There are things that you think are bad for you but actually it is the opposite.

        Syariah law will someday find its place in Malaysia. Insya-Allah. It is from Allah.

  16. Flag of Truth says:

    # Fadz

    In Quran there is a clear guidance on how to deal with people like Lina Joy. It is from Allah.

    • Adam says:

      Flag of Truth,

      Hi. Please try not to use the name of your God Allah in vain.

      So, what is Allah’s clear guidance on how to deal with apostates like Lina Joy? In Malaysia, she was persecuted and possibly jailed like Makcik Kamariah Ali? In Saudi Arabia, she would most likely be sentenced to death? Which action is clear in the Quran or has each country her own clear guidance as interpreted by the authorities?

      What if Allah does not advocate such actions and punishments against unbelievers, would it not be unjust and criminal to take away their freedom or their lives? Would it not be better and safer to try to get them back into the fold and if that fails, to let them go in peace? This way, there is still a chance that they may one day rediscover the faith. If you use force, chances of them coming back would be slim and if death is pronounced, chances will be nil.

    • Kong Kek Kuat says:

      @ Flag of Truth

      Does the Quran also have clear guidance on racism, bigotry and hypocrisy?

      • Flag of Truth says:

        @ Kong Kek Kuat

        To answer your question, yes. The Quran does have the answer for EVERYTHING.

        But your question has a double meaning. How about yourself? Do you support racism? Bigotry and hypocrisy? Do you support what happened in Chinese-owned entities where such things are allowed to happen? I don’t have to list it down here. All of you know or you just turn blind eyes to all of that.

        • Kong Kek Kuat says:

          @ Flag of Truth

          Huh? What about me? Maybe you could name one or two “Chinese-owned entities” where racism, bigotry, and hypocrisy are allowed to happen? I don´t know if all of you know, but I don´t know. Maybe you could tell us all about it.

          • Flag of Truth says:

            Lol.. well that is funny. Are you in business at all? [A]ll right let us say that you do not pretend that it is happeninh. If you read the classified column in certain newspaper[s] you will find that certain compan[ies] requires those who speak Mandarin and all of us knows what that means. Come on, this particular company don’t [do] business with CHINA at all, and furthermore the appointment is just on [a] clerical and managerial level. So I wonder why these compan[ies] put that kind of requirement[?]

            And to [make things worse], there [is a] different pay scheme.

            But I know you will continuously […] deny it. It is ok.. we can always live like this, if that is what you want.

          • Adam says:

            Flag of Truth,

            Allow me to re-adjust your incorrect perception of this situation of Chinese-owned companies employing only Chinese. When a company is fully owned by a private individual, it is entirely up to the person who he wants to employ. It is his absolute right. Just as a Malay-owned company employing only Malays, there is nothing racist about it. In fact, by advertising for positions for any particular race, it saves the others the time and futile effort in applying for the job.

            Likewise, if you set up your own company, you could employ all Malays/Muslims and nobody should call you a racist/bigot. You could also award all your jobs to all your own people and no one should complain.

            On the other hand, if you have partners, you have to consider their feelings and views to be fair. Taking this further, Government companies and enterprises belong to all Malaysians with each holding an equal share irrespective of social standing. So, there should be some semblance of fairness in employing people and more so, in awarding of projects by tenders.

            Hope you now have a clear distinction on the issue.

  17. Flag of Truth says:

    @ Kong Kek Kuat and Adam

    The Quran is from Allah, there is no doubt in that. Who am I to question the word from Allah? I just want to say, leave Muslim matters to Muslims, who truly profess that Allah is the one and only God and Muhammad is His messenger.

    • Kong Kek Kuat says:

      @ Flag of Truth

      Nope, can´t do that — because Muslims don´t leave non-Muslim matters to non-Muslims.

      In any case, I´m still waiting for you to tell me where in the Quran Allah has spoken about racists, bigots, and hypocrites.

      • Flag of Truth says:

        lol.. and what do you mean that Muslims do not [leave] non Muslim matters to non Muslims? I would like to know what kind of situation are you referring to?

        And about your question about racism. Sure I will explain it to you. In Quran (Surah Al Hujurat (49:13)”O mankind, indeed We have created you from male and female and made you peoples and tribes that you may know one another. Indeed, the most noble of you in the sight of Allah is the most righteous of you. Indeed, Allah is Knowing and Acquainted.”

        Allah [has] made it clear that we can be from various tribe[s], male or female but the most noble of us is the one who is most ‘righteous’. Now the word ‘righteous’ means those who believe in Him. And because of this concept Muslim[s], whether he or she is Malay, Chinese Muslim or Indian Muslim or any other [M]uslim is ‘the most righteous’ person compared to other people (if only he or she adhere[s] to the instruction[s] from Allah SWT).

        Mr Kong Kek Kuat. In Islam we favour our brothers and sisters in Islam more than those who are […] non believers. Like you, surely you favour your family and kin more than other people. It is human nature Mr kong kek kuat. And Islam is the religion who truly knows the nature of human being[s].

    • Adam says:

      Flag of Truth,

      So, with that statement of yours, you think you can absolve yourself from the possible miscarriage of justice in case Allah does not in fact advocate such punishments but it is the incorrect interpretations of His word by man?

      I wonder what defense you have on the day of judgment in front of the Almighty. Would you dare say that it is His instructions or that you are just following what the religious leaders say? Either way, you would be a dead duck at His mercy.

      I could conceivably hear Him lamenting why most of His followers, when things do not go right, always blame others for their own failures and shortcomings. When you cannot convince or persuade people to believe and continue believing, you should blame yourself and not those who have lost faith. If I had wanted all of mankind to believe Me, I would have programmed them as such from the beginning of time.

      So, please reassess your stance. As for leaving Muslim matters to Muslims, I cannot do that as Muslims are also my fellow humans and all of us must help one another to make this world a better place. I will definitely cut you some slack if Muslims practised complete freedom of faith without coercion and intimidation.

  18. Flag of Truth says:

    # Adam

    I will stand firm on my belief :). Muslim matters should be left to the Muslims. How do other people feel (non muslim) if Muslims start questioning their beliefs and practices?.

    But I understand that I cannot prevent you from asking and questioning :).

    And to answer your question with regards miscarriages. Allah prevents us from killing humans (Surah Al Isra’ (17:33) without any justified reason. I admit that different clerics have different views with regards this issue. But I don’t understand if you say that miscarriage is not allowed in Islam. Actually it is allowed IF there is reason for doing it (example in rape cases or in situations when the mother’s health is in question). This is to name a few.

    But if a woman conceives a child from an intercourse outside marriage and she wants to abort it simply because she doesn’t like the father (of that child) or doesn’t want any connection with the child, then it is not allowed.

    I don’t know why must you say that Muslims often blame other people for their short comings (If I get your statement right). Don’t other people do it too? :).

    Actually I believe in Qada’ and Qadar (fate). I believe in Allah’s will. If it is my fate to face some difficulties in this world I should turn to Allah for His guidance.We are here in this world to be judged. and we will meet our Creator one day :).

    • Adam says:


      Of course, you have the free choice of standing firm and sticking to your belief and whether what you believe is the ultimate truth or not, would be between you and your God. There is no issue on this. But, when you act on what you believe to be the commands of your God and it affects other people’s freedom and lives, we have to get involved. Even if it were your children who want to apostasise and you would want to punish or maybe kill them, we, as a civil society, have to get involved; what more, if they were our own children or siblings.

      If you believe in God’s will, let him do His work in us and let Him be our judge. He should not be asking you to carry out His judgment, not when our lives have not come to an end yet.

  19. Flag of Truth says:


    This is just to let you know, maybe I have not read your statement thoroughly :). I thought when you said about “miscarriage of justice” it refers to something else which I [had earlier commented on]. Therefore please forgive my mistake :).I am a human after all.

    Now to answer your actual question on “Miscarriages of justice”. I admit that there are clerics who have their own opinions but this is in certain cases only and they only contradict on matters concerning the implementation of certain things (that is not compromising the very basic foundation in Islam).

    In Islam the interpretation of the Quran is based on the explanation from prophet Muhammad (pbuh) whether this is from his own words or conduct. If someone is not clear about any of the verses that he or she reads from the Quran, they can refer this to Hadis and Sunnah.

    • Adam says:

      Yes FoT, to err is human; to forgive, divine. Humans should learn how to forgive. There should be no problems in simple mistakes like you misreading words. There is nothing to forgive. We commit such mistakes all the time but we learn from our mistakes as well as from others.

      The problem is with committing grave errors in our lives like hurting people physically and emotionally. We have to be extra careful in making judgments and taking actions which would affect negatively the lives of others; actions which could not be undone such as killing accidentally and more so, intentionally.

      I hope you get the message I am driving at. Peace.

  20. Flag of Truth says:

    @ JW Tan,

    When you said that it is the company’s privilege to hire whoever they want, well I beg to differ. This is Malaysia, where when 2 people who have the same qualification are given different pay just because of one particular reason (which I have stated earlier).

    Now using this same argument (that Chinese companies can do whatever they want), what do you think about the recent campaign by some Muslims to buy only goods/products produced by Muslim owned companies? Can you can accept this as their privilege to do so? That it is alright that Muslims buys only from Muslims? :).

  21. Adam says:


    I believe you are responding to my comment to you and not JW Tan’s.

    You should know that 2 persons may have the same qualifications but do they have the same quality of skills? In the 90s, we employed TAR College Diploma holders at the same starting pay as degree holders from some public universties just because they were of equivalent standard. It is also a question of supply and demand. If you have a glut of certain graduates, one would be able to offer them lower salaries. It makes business sense.

    As for your other contention of Muslims buying from Muslims, of course they could do so just as Penangites threatened to stop patronising Nasi Kandar shops some time back due to the actions of some Indian Muslims. Whether the actions are justified or not is another matter for the people concerned to ponder on. The point is your money, your choice. The question is why limit your choices.

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